Don't you just hate Gnome 42?

Lounge EndeavourOS pub
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This has been an unfortunate misunderstanding from almost the very beginning and it’s been tough to distinguish from what the plans of Gnome devs were to what the users would end up with in the future. It’s a lot to say honestly and a lot of it has been said on various Gnome dev blog posts and other sources I can’t remember, which I don’t even have bookmarked (oops!), but I know Nick from The Linux Experiment did a well put together video on the topic a few months ago that explains most (not all) of what exactly is happening. Check that video out here if you like, it’s worth a watch if your a Gnome user:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pdx_MwcMtnM (from Oct 2021)

He did a follow up video a few months later using Fedora and showing a bit more detail that is also worth a watch:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQrIf3Rkjjs (from March 2022)

With that said, Gnome 42 is out, GTK4 is out, libadwaita is out, and ~95% of my Gnome apps are still on GTK2/GTK3. So is it fair to say I hate Gnome 42 for only 5% of something? The Gnome apps that are GTK4/libadwaita now are just a few core apps like Calculator, Clocks, Disk Analyzer, Gnome Contacts, Gnome Software, and just a few others. The rest still need work to be ported, tested, and updated and that work will be ongoing for a while.

We might see a few apps get ported to GTK4 and released in this cycle, but most of that work will otherwise be pushed to Gnome 43. Which is also the release planned for the re-coloring API, so “theme’ish” abilities will be possible. It’s possible even now to theme GTK4 apps on Gnome now, there’s at least 2 methods I’m aware of, though they are unsupported and one of them is really only meant for developer testing.

In all honesty, 6 months ago I thought this Gnome theme fiasco thing would break me and have my bags packing elsewhere. But I knew the change wasn’t going to be instant or immediate. Having been using Gnome throughout this time, it’s really just one of those things that gets blown out of proportion.

Here’s an analogy for this scenario: I look at this whole thing like a speed bump, not a road block. Now no one likes speed bumps, but they are there to help maintain safety for all. In that regard, Gnomes move is to help the developers and make things easier for them. Do I want devs to be happy working on Gnome/GTK? Of course. And for many devs these changes, while it’s like going over a speed bump, are only inconvenient for a brief moment before you’re back up to speed.

Hopefully you find some solace in that last statement, I know I do. And one thing I forgot to mention, much like Fedora being on the edge of using new technology before others (pipewire, wayland, etc), Gnome too is always progressing forward with a clear vision of theirs; consistent releases, consistently using new technologies packages and implementing the latest builds from upstream to give a streamlined experience for developers as well as users.

Other than the bugs that I’ve encountered and have mentioned previously ( here ), I would say the Gnome release if anything, annoyed me on the first day. Then a few things were fixed and/or a solution was found, so the annoyance quickly subsided. I still have two or three ongoing bugs, none are deal-breakers thankfully, but I’m hoping it gets resolved by the end of this month with Gnome 42.1 and then I won’t have to worry about anything except for the conundrum of if I want to stay on Ext4 or try out Btrfs :sweat_smile:

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Exactly. The reason why Internet Explorer (now Microsoft Edge) has such a massive market share is because of people simply being too lazy to say, “I don’t like this; let me change it.”

Instead, they just complain endlessly and say, “I don’t like this, but that’s too complicated. I’d rather complain some more.”

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I was about to answer the main question “Don’t you just hate Gnome 42?” with something like “why I should care about a tool? If I don’t like it, I can use another one”, then I remembered that I used to hate Windows and complain about it for so many years, until I’ve got tired and moved away from it.

I won’t be that lazy guy anymore; in fact, that’s why I’m using EndeavourOS, I didn’t like some stuff about my first distro and came here.

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Yep. I started using Arch via Antergos (now gone) because I got tired of Ubuntu and its derivatives, and eventually got tired of distro-hoping.

However, because Manjaro broke a few times, I decided to download and try a leaner Arch derivative. So far, so great!

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I have experienced far too many issues with Gnome - I don’t think it was all Gnome - but the extensions I used.

Well - you could say Gnome asked for it - after all they made extensions a thing - but bad extensions and bad themes can break a system.

Due to the - possible - javascript embedded in a theme (same goes for Plasma) it is quite easy to have a theme break in the most awkward ways.

I feel exactly the same way as OP - computer is a tool - which is why I use an Arch based system. The ability to build a system from ground up (not peeling the onion to get to the core - which by the way calls for tears - also in computing) and have it just the way I work - that is the force of Arch - the user-centric instead of user-friendly - the latter is another word for laziness or an unwilling attitude towards learning.

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Part of the reason i maintain my own themes these days, was confusing at first but taught me a lot

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I started before that - but Antergos Gnome was one I used for quite some time.

I have typed myself through the Arch Wiki more times than I care to admin :slight_smile:

Well - I have been running Manjaro as my main system for +5 years on unstable branch - I haven’t had any issues I wouldn’t have had otherwise - as the issues I have had was mostly self inflicted :slight_smile:

But I realize that some has had a fair share of issues.

Arch does not have the reputaion for being 100% stable. In my experience Manjaro increases the stablity of Arch with their branch structure - as packages which proves unstable - e.g. some systemd releases in the past, and lately NFS and Samba and Network Manager where the DSL PPoE regressed.

Such issues almost never reaches Manjaro stable branch.

I only said this because Manjaro was mentioned - we should not turn this into a discusson of Manjaro - this is OT.

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:sweat_smile: Those issues are always funny.

For me though, it was two different -Syyu commands that broke my system (each within about 3 months or so). The second one made me lose files because it wouldn’t boot after a restart, I only had a jumpdrive copy of Windows - but not Manjaro, and I needed to use my computer within a few hours for work.

Unfortunately, the files weren’t fully uploaded to the cloud before the reboot. :unamused:

I actually stopped using Linux on a whole for a few months because of it. Was both mad at Manjaro and at myself. :pensive:

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:+1:

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I have liked all the gnomes 1, 2, 3 and 4x

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@HMS_Endeavour - Regarding the sheer number of KDE Plasma settings, you do realise that you only need to configure your desktop UI once - right? After it is customised to your taste you can forget about it until your use case changes.

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As simple as this is until you understand the settings and what they change this can be confusing, i was confused at first

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Scotty, thanks for your thoughtful reply. and for quoting me so extensively :thinking:

It was where I saw the statement “end of theming” and got me curious to see what Gnome’s vision is.

Let’s watch the release schedule https://wiki.gnome.org/FortyTwo

Interesting analogy. Since dark theme solves my visual impairment, the rest I can wait for, so yes, it’s a minr inconvenience the few times I use something that that does not respect the theme.

For me that conundrum is solved. I was already on Btrfs when I tried unsuccessfully to bend KDE to my will. I had such a mess removing the Plasma remnants that I decided it was time to start afresh. So doing it over with Btrfs with Gnome 42 was an easy choice, given Dalto’s amazing Btrfs Assistant combined with grub-btrfs and snapper. Could not be happier with this combo, since I have broken my EOS install countless times.

I saw Fedora have used Btrfs since 33 and Gnome 42 by default on Fedora 36. Ext4’s developer said Btrfs is a better direction, so my choice was easy. Maybe this will help you with your decision. https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/BtrfsByDefault

So glad to have a lounge where we can discuss things that others feel doesn’t matter like choice of DE :grin:

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I have no desire to try Gnome 42. If you like it, cool. I had at one time liked Gnome, but it seemed like every release they would take a feature away that I liked and felt useful that I then had to replace with an extension, only for that extension to either break with the next release or the developer stop working on. It was such a cat and mouse game. I switched to KDE, and now I can make my workflow similar to gnome without having to rely on some random extensions or my DE deciding I can no longer do things my way anymore.

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It would be really cool if someone did a tutorial on changing KDE to a similar workflow as Gnome.

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I am not sure if there is one specify for gnome, but I know there is one to make it like unity. Why Ubuntu Should Use KDE Plasma Instead of GNOME - YouTube

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Pretty sure ive seen a few videos describing how to do this on youtube, cant remember when or who posted them but

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You just install KDE and it works. You don’t have to customize the crap out of it and then wonder why it doesn’t work properly. I have zero issues with most desktops because i don’t tend to do this. I make minor settings changes and maybe background or icons and any settings changes that work and that i find appealing. I never need any extensions because everything is already there to make a great desktop. I don’t need or want a Gnome work flow i already have KDE Plasma and it’s great!

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True, i can’t help myself though, a word of advise i’d give to anyone playing around with themes/customization is to do it in small steps and take note of what you change as some settings will only take place on login/out/reboot

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And this is the one I’m looking at: https://wiki.gnome.org/FortyThree