Could EOS be for me?

[SideWinder]

Hello everybody, I am new to EOS/Arch and Linux as a whole, so please excuse my ignorance. I came across EOS via the Arch pipeline. Arch seems to be way over my head and from what I can tell, EOS comes with glowing reviews (not the Fed kind of glowing ). I’ve been reading this forum for fun for a while and think this is a great community. I’m writing to see if those of you who know way more then me would think EOS could be a good distro for me. Here’s where I’m at.

-Long term Mac user
----I love Mac and am very comfortable with it
-Been messing with Linux for a few months
----Mostly Mint

I plan on still using a Mac but would also like a Linux machine. I am use to Mac just working, I update as soon as there is anything to update. I know Arch has a rep of breaking but I hear conflicting things. My use case with Linux would be,

-Browsing
-Watching media (mostly Youtube/Rumble)
-Email
-Some creative work (Video editing, Graphics)
-Some git related projects [Making Websites, light coding (I am not a programmer at all, mainly some html/css)]
-Social Media (Maybe spinning up a fedi server)
-Chat (Matrix, Discord, Forums)
-Crypto

My main concerns are not having to waste tons of time fixing things, going down rabbit holes to get solutions, creating security issues for myself. I’m willing to put some work into fixing things if need be.
Mac is super simple, secure and easy to use and that is what I am most used to. At this point I am between EOS and Fedora. Ubuntu/Deb packages are just too out of date for me. I always get the latest stuff on Mac when it’s available.

One last note, I did some research and found that everything I pretty much need is in the Arch repos. The only thing is Mullvad, which is in the AUR. From what I can tell, it looks clean and not malicious. Are there any resources I can look into to learn about how to read/audit an AUR package? Also, in the dependencies section, it lists 6 of them, but each are followed by dependencies in parenthesis, for example

nss (nss-hgAUR)

What does this mean exactly?

Thanks to any and all insight

[dalto]

EOS will work fine for your use case. That being said, the people who tend to be most satisfied are those who are a little curious and don’t mind learning. In general, moving to Linux will be a decent learning curve no matter which distro you select.

@SideWinder

What does this mean exactly?

That means that the package depends on nss, however, there are other packages that provide that dependency. Specifically, nss-hg

@SideWinder

Are there any resources I can look into to learn about how to read/audit an AUR package?

AUR PKGBUILDs

The AUR is one of the safest ways to install software, just because it is so transparent. But it does not tolerate just looking up the package in Pamac and clicking on the Build button, or doing yay package_name blindly. It requires that the user knows what’s going on. That’s why I recommend trying to build at least one package manually, to understand what’s going on, before using an AUR helper like pamac or yay. yay has a nice feature that allows you to inspect a PKGBUILD file before installin…

[Kresimir]

@SideWinder

I know Arch has a rep of breaking but I hear conflicting things.

How to you know that, if you hear conflicting things? It’s absolute rubbish, btw. It is very rare that something breaks on Arch on its own, it’s mostly users who break things. And that’s okay, breaking things is good for learning.

Whether EndeavourOS is good for you or not, only you can answer. All of the things you’ve listed can be done on EndeavourOS (and pretty much any other distro).

[nate]

@SideWinder

nss (nss-hgAUR)

What does this mean exactly?

Just to add to what @dalto has already said about the dependency, the package manager will automatically install the dependencies of a package, you don’t need to do anything about it.

Sometimes multiple packages offer the same feature and can satisfy the same dependency, in which case the package manager will prompt you at install time to choose one from a list of packages that offer that dependency.

So to answer your direct question: first is the dependency, then in the parenthesis the package(s) that satisfy that dependency and the repository where this package is found.

Regarding stability, Arch theoretically “has the potential to break” due to how close to bleeding edge it is, however, in my experience of over 6 years with it (and its derivatives) there has been no incident that would brick my system or force some extreme measures to login to my desktop session. There were two or three instances where manual steps had to be done after an update or something broke. Those steps are usually described during the update process.

[Schlaefer]

You should be fine esp. if you used Linux before (like Mint). I switched from the Mac to Manjaro (EndeavourOS didn’t exist yet).

Creative work is probably the issue most in question. If possible you should check available applications (like Kdenlive or Krita) on Mint.

In my experience Arch doesn’t break, it just receives software earlier. That means you may run into more x.0 version bugs, but you also receive features and bugfixes earlier.

Using EndeavourOS eliminates 95% of the complexity of Arch, but you’re still required to use the command line for updates and occasional maintenance tasks. If you’re familiar with git, light coding (using a text editor), spinning up a server … that should have you covered.

So expect some friction in the beginning, because Arch/EOS isn’t targeted at a GUI only audience, but it feels that shouldn’t be a problem at your skill level.

[SideWinder]

How to you know that, if you hear conflicting things?

My bad, maybe I wasn’t clear with what I meant. What I meant was, I know that Arch has a reputation of breaking because in looking into Arch, many people say it but I also see people saying the opposite.

@nate

Just to add to what @dalto has already said about the dependency, the package manager will automatically install the dependencies of a package, you don’t need to do anything about it.

So in the case of this Mullvad package, because it depends on nss, and nss is in the Arch repo, it will get it from the Arch repo and not those other AUR packages correct?

[SideWinder]

@Schlaefer

Creative work is probably the issue most in question. If possible you should check available applications (like Kdenlive or Krita) on Mint.

Creative work as in making dank memes . I think Gimp/Inkscape/KdenLive is enough for me

[drunkenvicar]

it’s linux, you can do all this:
“-Browsing
-Watching media (mostly Youtube/Rumble)
-Email
-Some creative work (Video editing, Graphics)
-Some git related projects [Making Websites, light coding (I am not a programmer at all, mainly some html/css)]
-Social Media (Maybe spinning up a fedi server)
-Chat (Matrix, Discord, Forums)
-Crypto”

if you want to stay sesame street, stay with the Mac, there will be a learning curve and with a good attitude you will move mountains. sounds like you have a lot figured out already so you are ready for this. The Mac runs the computer. With Linux you run the computer is the best I got here…

and since you asked:

At this point I am between EOS and Fedora.
[/quote]

Having lived on both I would choose Arch in a new york minute. I just didn’t get that ‘charge’ using Fedora every day. Hard to explain. edit: I get that ‘charge’ from Endeavour.

[dalto]

@SideWinder

So in the case of this Mullvad package, because it depends on nss, and nss is in the Arch repo, it will get it from the Arch repo and not those other AUR packages correct?

Technically, it depends what you use to install it. However, in most cases, yes that is correct.

[smokey]

@Kresimir

breaking things is good for learning

This is where I have often learnt the most.

[Archnoob]

You’ll like Endeavour. It’s a fairly easy way to jump into arch. To get going you really only have to learn the commands for installing and removing packages. They’re simple using pacman and yay

You might want to bookmark the main arch page so you can search for packages in the repository or AUR there to make sure you’re installing the right ones.

I’d recommend KDE to start with. Gnome is very solid and looks nice too but less customizable, however extensions can help with that. XFCE is solid, lightweight, and pretty easy to use but it isn’t as slick and modern looking as the other two I named, although it can still look nice with the right themes. It’s development is also slower

[Melways]

@SideWinder

-Some creative work (Video editing, Graphics)

As Desktop environment I would recommend KDE/Plasma or Gnome. XFCE does not do well in graphics intensive applications.

A few other things:

As mentioned elsewhere linux in general has a learning curve and for terminal based distro’s like arch and its derivatives (to which endeavour belongs) this is even more so. Some things just can’t be done with the mouse and endeavour is aimed at intermediate users. So for a newbie you would have to be willing to learn (that is have time to learn).

Before making a switch to linux it is also good to remember to check that apps you want to use are available (or useful alternatives). If you need photoshop for example - that is not available for linux (and if someone recommends GIMP as an alternative then you should run that person over with a steamroller).

[ricklinux]

EOS is for everyone! Anyone who want’s to learn with the intent to put in an effort can. Welcome to the purple side.

[Bear]

Hi @SideWinder

I personally use both Mint and Endeavour. I have been using Mint for… I have forgotten how many years now!

For what you want a Linux Machine for, both distributions will do the job well. There are a huge number of .deb installation files available as you probably know and whatever doesn’t come in .deb format, comes in Flatpak or Snap (It’s simple to get Mint to use Snap packages, if you don’t know how, just ask me.).

I have also built vanilla Arch quite a few times for the fun of it, but I prefer the simplicity and frankly, the aesthetics of EOS, it’s a beautiful, and very well-made distribution without getting away from Arch. It certainly is a much easier distribution to install and maintain that plain Arch.

Saying that…

@SideWinder

My main concerns are not having to waste tons of time fixing things, going down rabbit holes to get solutions

A very common thing said about Mint is that “It Just Works”. And yes I can testify that a number of things are easier to do on Mint than on EOS, for instance configuring the Firewall, adding a printer, even setting up your wifi are all noticeably easier on Mint. I am I saying that Endeavour is difficult - no, I am not. As I said I use this distro, and it has made Arch incredibly easy. It is just more fiddly that a distribution made to just work out of the box with minimal messing.

I choose to use EOS as well because I can mess and play around with it, more than I can with Mint.

Regarding Desktop environments, find the one that suits you best. Personally, I love Cinnamon which is the standard DE with Mint. One of the brilliant things about EOS, is that it’s a great way to try different Desktop Environments. Mint on the other hand, only has a few to try.

No matter which distribution you choose, I recommend installing Timeshift, which allows you to roll back your distribution if you mess up and break it. Instead of having to fix the problem, you can easily take it back to a time when it was working - probably before you just installed that app or updated or messed about with that dot file

So… If you like using the DE that you have on Mint, I would keep using it. If you want to try something else and play a little (which Linux is famous for) that EOS is a great choice. Basically, both will do what you want, Mint has less messing about. I know that some people will disagree and say that EOS is simple, which it is, in comparison to Arch, but I use both, and Mint “Just Works”. Whereas I do have some messing with EOS, which suits ME, maybe not YOU. Remember, even if you choose one distro now, it doesn’t mean that you have committed your life to it, just back up your data and you can play with others. Or even like me, and dual boot with 2 Linux distros, I don’t use either Mac or Windows.

[Bear]

Just watched an interesting video, suggesting Linux beginners focus on choosing a Desktop Environment rather than choosing a Distribution.

STOP RECOMMENDING DISTROS, recommend DESKTOPS instead!

[Svartis]

Totally right, except for 1 point. You should know if you want bleeding edge or solid lts, beside this every distro serves about the same experience to new linux users. They all have their gui supported update possibilities, most settings are irrelevant for an enduser, who only wants a workstation to do their office related stuff. About every Distro comes with an easy to handle installer nowadays (ok except for vanilla arch or void).

The desktop experience is the only thing that really makes a difference for an non tinkering enduser.

My 2 cents are Gnome for Laptops or users with no relation to it, KDE for Desktops. But opinions may differ here, as always

Cinnamon is an option to, but due to the lag of solid wayland support I wouldn’t recommend it atm.

[kagetora13]

I guess you dodged the bullet with grub.

GRUB Broke My Arch Linux Installation!!

I find the more applications you have, the greater chance of a break.

What I notice with users, they think its the distro breaking. But its software/applications. And in many cases things are broken (and you don’t know the usecase).

How many people saw this one in Gnome/Steam this week?

Fullscreen Application, on "top", is click-through, changing focus to "below"...

[kagetora13]

Welcome to Arch/EOS!

The best part of this community is you are constantly learning. People like @dalto sharing their knowledge. I’m tempted to run chatgpt to see if it could compete. Obviously not as charming .

Out of curiousity, what shortfall did you hit in Mint where you wanted to chsnge distros?

In my case, when I came back to Linux it was definitely custimization, package management and the aur which caused me to move the 6 family computers off Windows 10. Unless there is a security issue, most systems get updated monthly. And i do file on average 2 bugs a month (sometimes add notes to other peoples bugs).

IMHO, things are always breaking (just not obvious where). So i do the responsible thing, observe, report my findings, support the community and developers. There is no free ride. Its all of us together improving the user experience. I have grown allot in the Linux community, which happens to aid my career. I’m sure you have had the same realization.

[kagetora13]

Actually we were Antegos before, so alive and kicking when Manjaro was on top:

https://endeavouros.com/about-us/

But I was a Manjaro user for a couple years too. I wanted a slower release channel (with my QA brain wanting more testing). But then I learned my perception of stability was flawed (espcially with hybrid Intel/nvidia laptop). So I came back yo Antegos/EndeavorOS. Not even Fedora has tempted me away.

[Noodly]