What is your main constructive criticism about EOS?

I couldn’t ever imagine using another distro other than EOS for as long as it is around, but if it ever did unfortunately disappear on us, Artix Linux would be the only other Arch distro contender I would consider as the values and mission appears to be fairly close to EOS. (i hope im not breaking a rule adding that link) :purple_heart:

I guess this thread proves that a great job is being done here! If the ‘main’ thing that can be ‘improved’ seems to be adding wallpapers, we have it made!

As far as wallpapers go - I have seen thousands, and tried hundreds (at least) and IMHO it is impossible to come up with a great wallpaper selection - even if we had nearly unlimited people working on it. My own experience suggests that an attractive wallpaper is not only found in the eye of the beholder, but that eye too changes in an unpredictable manner. I can’t even count the number of times I have found a wallpaper I like, and install - and want to change in less than a week once I try to ‘live’ with it. Yes, I have tried variety (and other changers, including my own scripts) but that doesn’t cut it either. If it looks great on a quiet day (mostly showing), it might not be good on a busy one (mostly hidden). it might conflict visually with certain apps, or make them difficult to ‘quick scan’ for whatever.

Myself, I have found one or two that pass all the tests, and have stayed selected for a considerable time (thanks AntechDesigns!) - and I have seen a few from TilliDie (over on Garuda) that I might check further into - but any effort to ‘improve’ the choices on here are EXTREMELY misdirected effort, IMO, for the 1% chance that someone, sometime, might like and KEEP one of the selections that MIGHT be generated :grin:

As for the logo, that has a life of its own now - and the only change there that I could support would be the "A Sail’ variant that nearly made the cut originally - perhaps appropriately recoloured. Beyond that, brand recognition has happened, and it is easily picked out from a ‘set’ when that is the goal (rEFInd menu for example).

In ending, please remember that the team is quite small, and does an amazing job as it is - and keep trying to think of things that might improve it - especially if those things are things YOU can do :grin: Wiki articles come to mind (disclaimer: I work on the wiki!) - perhaps especially on procedures such as tracking where a package came from and how its dependencies can be tracked/handled when needed. Lots of other semi-complicated and not-every-day things re not covered yet in there…

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Raised hand slowly…gotta have my transparent xfce4-terminal.

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I’m quite new to the block with just three months of EOS, and so far I wouldn’t know what improvement to suggest. I think the defaults are right. I hope EOS will just remain this boringly stable up to date nicely designed OS.

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That plus, when things aren’t already done for you, but you want more, it helps you in learning how to get more, which in turn usually makes you more competent in whatever you’re doing.

Regarding options: When it comes to wallpapers and/or design (in general), most times I get rid of the defaults because I prefer something else from a previous install of a previous distro.

At the moment, I’m using Catppuccin Mocha colours + Fluent decorations + Tela icons, and I’ve uninstalled all theme-related packages and instead kept my own copies in .themes, .icons, and kvantum so that updates don’t revert my changes.

I say this to say, unless every design option is available in a distro, the overall design will not suit everyone’s needs.

And I’m sure no one wants every option to be available! :grimacing:
Heads would :exploding_head: from too much choice.

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So, we aren’t a distro that requires the use of the terminal?

When we started out, we didn’t mention the term “terminal centric” and our email and forum were flooded with questions about where the software center was and what we were thinking of not including Pamac or Octopi.
It was and is never our goal to be Linux novice-friendly, that approach became the dead stone weight of our predecessor Antergos.

Underneath is not a direct response to @ddnn but to the entire community.

The bitter truth is that, at the moment we have reached a critical point in our existence and we are at a fork in the road. One road is ending the project and the other one is to continue but with fewer features.

The current state is as follows:

  • There are three people on X86_64 development and two of them have more pressing matters to deal with in real life.
  • There are two people on ARM development and one of them doesn’t have much time to join in actively.
  • Our visual creator has left and there is one member who joined us recently offering their help but doesn’t have a creative background.

This project is a side project for all of us and we are dependent on community input and foremost help.
We do appreciate constructive criticism, but as I answered @Kundalini in a previous thread started by you, we are in need of HELP, and by responding creating a new thread with the same subject instead doesn’t help the team’s spirit to keep up the work.
We have chosen to continue the project with fewer features, don’t try to beat a team when they are down by kicking them with two similar threads without offering help.

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Ship it as close to a Vanilla Arch as possible, that is with the least amount of pre-configured features out of the box.

Anything and everything can be added to such a “blank slate” depending on the users’ needs which vary with each and everyone of them out there.

Perhaps work could be done on the Wiki side to meet such needs.

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I really like EOS because of it’s feature set. It delivers a nice way to setup a finetuned Arch Installation, along with a friendly, humorous community. It delivers the arch experience and makes it available for people that don’t want to tinker too much, while keeping things very basic and not bloated in any kind.

Arch isn’t a beginner friendly distro and perhaps will never be. There are other distributions, which are circeling those fishing grounds.

I didn’t know about the current situation among maintainers and the lack of support from the community. With this knowledge, I think the way of getting rid of dead community projects is a good point if one has to household with available time. It’s a good idea to focus on one thing and deliver it in the best possible quality. It would be a big loss if EOS disappears completely.

I’m no developer and I’m no media designer also. But if there is any simple stuff one can do, I would offer my help to keep this wonderful project alive.

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Too good to be real.

Best Arch experience, might add few words about Artix.
But even though I despise systemd, I realise there’s just too much stuff bound to it and to maintain all possible conflicts that might occur by it’s absence, this headache just not worth it.

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Man!!! For a second I thought you misinterpreted what I said. :weary::face_exhaling:

Wait, that does say “underneath”, so maybe you did? In any case, prior to this line, what you said is exactly what I meant.

  • Arch (in general) is not for new to Linux users
  • And just having the phrase “terminal-centric distro” should scare away any users who understand what a terminal is and know they are not good at using one or don’t want to use one
  • As such, find another distro - there are literally hundreds, if not thousands, and at least 20 that are “good enough” for new-to-Linux users, most of which are Ubuntu-based

PS: It’s not about blocking users from using a distro (Arch), it’s about understanding that you get far less handholding in learning “how to Linux” when you decide to use something Arch-based. Get to really understand something Ubuntu-based first, use the terminal there more, then, if it isn’t meeting your needs anymore, and you have the patience to read and learn even more, then you can consider using something Arch-based.

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Thanks for continuing the project.

I’ve been involved in two consecutive Xubuntu test-cycles - and even though my role was tiny the work involved did take up so much more time and effort than I had expected.

So, I can only imagine how much time the EOS-team members are spending to keep EOS rolling.

Your choice to focus on less features to at least be able to keep going, is understandable and really appreciated.

Thank you.

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A good decision. Get rid of all the dead weight and simplify maintenance – that’s the EndeavourOS philosophy that has been astonishingly successful in the past, and there is no reason to think it won’t be in the future.

If anything, EndeavourOS is not terminal-centric enough, and most of the problems seem to stem from that. There will always be people who whine about the terminal not being friendly to neophytes, and that is demonstrably false. It’s safe to ignore them.

All reasonable “feature” requests can be fulfilled here on the forum, by educating the users how to accomplish what they want themselves. No need to burden the ISO with any of that. As long as they are active here on the forum and willing to put in some effort, the users of EndeavourOS have nothing to fear.

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Maybe I missed it, but I don’t remember there ever being a post about exactly what help the EOS team needs; snippets here and there, but nothing stands out to me. I, for one, continue with EOS over Arch or its other derivatives for these reasons:

  1. This community: hands down the best of any distro I’ve ever used, and that goes back to the turn of the century (damn, that sounds old!). Even Linux Mint takes a back-seat.
  2. Ease of use: I don’t need EOS, but I sure as heck want EOS. Why go through all the hoops a typical vanilla Arch setup takes to configure/install when I have it all right here? I could spend the exact same amount of time building a Gentoo system from scratch - sorry, not a masochist anymore.

If it’s testing help you need, where do I sign up?. I’ve already got 20+ test VMs setup, what’s a couple of more? If it’s DE-flavor maintenance, I should be able to help. Guess it would depend on the level of python competence you’re expecting. In a nutshell, I’d be better suited for keeping the status quo stable than adding new features.

As stated by others, I’m thrilled that you’re continuing the project. Don’t focus so much on new stuff, just make your setup as stable as possible.

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:100:

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I want to be clear, the intentions are good and come from a place of love with such threads. Sometime’s it’s difficult to detect the emotion behind words through text on a screen, though I understand your point.

Whatever yourself and staff decide, I think I can speak for almost everyone when saying you have our full support.

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:+1:

:100:–the hard troubleshooting/remedy work done by others has immense value (you all probably don’t get told enough) for me personally as I’ve got out of some jams just by researching here.
edit:forgot word

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I have no criticism or ideas I JUST want to say i LOVE EndeavourOS! I never liked any distro until EOS.
I tried a lot in all the years from good old Mandrake Linux to Garuda, and I didn’t like any of them.

I don’t do much I Terminal (I remember the DOS days)
But I just it from time to time.

And I love the Welcome app and your other tools so please don’t kill that.

Users coming here and expecting a better Windows when Microsoft is the only on who can do that. I get tired of Users coming here and telling use how much better they could something with this other system Or how we need to make it prettier.

There is this thing in the Community called Freedom. That gives you the right to choose what is right for you and what is not right for you. Constructive Criticism with out the blood sweat and tears into a project only constitutes Criticism. And there is never anything Constructive about That.

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I think that some kind of feedback when using the mirror ranking would be great.

When you activate it in the welcome window (Don’t remember how it called, I don’t have it installed anymore) it does not give any kind of feedback that it has started, when I first used it I thought that it was not working, and kept activating it several times, I only noticed that it was working because my CPU was at 100% after activating it too many times.