# Switzerland plans surveillance worse than US šŸ˜± **URL:** \ **Category:** Linux lounge\ **Created:** [November 15, 2025, 10:52am UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393 "2025-11-15T10:52:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/cactux/32/134907_2.png) [@cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/cactux)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 10:52am UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/1 "2025-11-15T10:52:16Z")
TL;DR > If the law passes in its current form, > > - Swiss email and VPN providers with just 5,000 users are forced to log IP addresses and retain the data for six months - while [data retention in Germany is illegal for email providers](https://tuta.com/blog/data-retention-germany). > - ID or driverā€™s license, maybe a phone number, are required for the registration process of various services - rendering the anonymous usage impossible. > - Data must be delivered upon request in plain text, meaning providers must be able to decrypt user data on their end (except for end-to-end encrypted messages exchanged between users). > > What is more, the law is not introduced by or via the Parliament, but instead the Swiss government, the Federal Council and the Federal Department of Justice and Police (FDJP), want to massively expand internet surveillance by updating the VƜPF - without Parliament having a say. This comes as a shock in a country proud of its direct democracy with regular peopleā€™s decisions on all kinds of laws. However, in 2016 [the Swiss actually voted for more surveillance](https://tuta.com/blog/surveillance-switzerland), so direct democracy might not help here. > We at Tuta Mail are fighting legal attempts to undermine encryption on all fronts such as [Chat Control](https://tuta.com/blog/chat-control-criticism), the [EU framework ProtectEU](https://tuta.com/blog/open-letter-against-protecteu), [Swedenā€™s attempt](https://tuta.com/blog/open-letter-sweden-encryption) to backdoor encryption, and now Switzerlandā€™s update of the VƜPF. > **[Switzerland plans surveillance worse than US | Tuta](https://tuta.com/blog/switzerland-surveillance-plan)** > > Revision of Swiss surveillance law VƜPF would directly target VPN & encrypted chat and email providers based in Switzerland. Me caught on a surveillance camera loosing social credit points ![](https://forum.endeavouros.com/uploads/default/original/3X/0/2/02189f976cf3d886a6c62cf2f250835ec3975f4a.gif) ---
**Author:** ![r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/r0ckhopper/32/51768_2.png) [@r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/r0ckhopper)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:06pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/2 "2025-11-15T12:06:14Z")
> [@cactux](#): > > [https://tuta.com/blog/switzerland-surveillance-plan](https://tuta.com/blog/switzerland-surveillance-plan) This is why Proton is considering relocating from šŸ‡ØšŸ‡­ > **["We would be less confidential than Google" ā€“ Proton threatens to quit...](https://www.techradar.com/vpn/vpn-privacy-security/we-would-be-less-confidential-than-google-proton-threatens-to-quit-switzerland-over-new-surveillance-law)** > > If passed, new rules would require VPNs and messaging apps to identify and retain users' data ---
**Author:** ![MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/mynameisrichard/32/111876_2.png) [@MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/MyNameIsRichard)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:10pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/3 "2025-11-15T12:10:10Z")
Iā€™ll have to find another DNS provider than quad9, which is a pain. ---
**Author:** ![r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/r0ckhopper/32/51768_2.png) [@r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/r0ckhopper)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:11pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/4 "2025-11-15T12:11:27Z")
I use the Mullvad one as you can also block ads, trackers etc. ---
**Author:** ![Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/Cphusion)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:31pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/5 "2025-11-15T12:31:55Z")
Quad is in Switzerland? ---
**Author:** ![MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/mynameisrichard/32/111876_2.png) [@MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/MyNameIsRichard)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:33pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/6 "2025-11-15T12:33:21Z")
Thatā€™s where theyā€™re based. They have servers all over the world but all subject to Switzerlandā€™s laws. ---
**Author:** ![SCORPION2000](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/scorpion2000/32/39398_2.png) [@SCORPION2000](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/SCORPION2000)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:39pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/7 "2025-11-15T12:39:41Z")
Yeah alot of governments want mass surveillance šŸ¤¬ Including my home country of Sweden(which Iā€™m not living in atm). And i hope Proton lives Switzerland to avoid this. ---
**Author:** ![Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/Cphusion)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:51pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/8 "2025-11-15T12:51:45Z")
Does Mullvad have normal dns servers that arenā€™t DOH, as Iā€™m going to be switching my vps dns configuration over to something else and I would prefer to use Mullvad. ---
**Author:** ![Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/Cphusion)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 12:56pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/9 "2025-11-15T12:56:58Z")
> **[DNS Resolvers - Privacy Guides](https://www.privacyguides.org/en/dns/)** > > We recommend choosing these encrypted DNS providers to replace your ISP's default configuration. > **[Best Encrypted DNS in 2025: Protect Your Browsing Privacy](https://www.privacytools.io/encrypted-dns)** > > Secure your internet browsing with encrypted DNS resolvers and clients. Choose from the best privacy-focused options available. Does anyone know a better alternative for Quad? ---
**Author:** ![r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/r0ckhopper/32/51768_2.png) [@r0ckhopper](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/r0ckhopper)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:15pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/10 "2025-11-15T13:15:32Z")
Their setup guide says they use both DNS over HTTPS (DoH) and DNS over TLS (DoT) > **[DNS over HTTPS and DNS over TLS](https://mullvad.net/en/help/dns-over-https-and-dns-over-tls)** > > Our public DNS service ---
**Author:** ![Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/Cphusion)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:20pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/11 "2025-11-15T13:20:23Z")
> [@r0ckhopper](#): > > Their setup guide says they use both DNS over HTTPS (DoH) and DNS over TLS (DoT) > > [https://mullvad.net/en/help/dns-over-https-and-dns-over-tls](https://mullvad.net/en/help/dns-over-https-and-dns-over-tls) Thanks I did see that. Iā€™m just using /etc/resolv.conf on my vpses, donā€™t really want to change that. Does anyone know if this new law in Swizterland will require me to to register an account at Quad to keep using their public dns servers? ---
**Author:** ![albersc2](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/albersc2/32/120996_2.png) [@albersc2](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/albersc2)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:20pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/12 "2025-11-15T13:20:32Z")
Iā€™m not sure whether Iā€™m more worried about the law itself or the way they intend to impose it, without even going through Parliament. Unfortunately, the world we live in is increasingly moving toward an authoritarian control model, which is essentially a disguised dictatorship. ---
**Author:** ![AceFour](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/acefour/32/69835_2.png) [@AceFour](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/AceFour)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:23pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/13 "2025-11-15T13:23:49Z")
Unreal. Wonder where these companies would move too ---
**Author:** ![cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/cactux/32/134907_2.png) [@cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/cactux)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:25pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/14 "2025-11-15T13:25:30Z")
> [@Cphusion](#): > > this new law in Swizterland For now it has not yet become a law. Itā€™s a proposal. However it would be wise to have a plan for when you come to that river to find a bridge to cross over. ---
**Author:** ![Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/c/58956e/32.png) [@Cphusion](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/Cphusion)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:26pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/15 "2025-11-15T13:26:51Z")
> [@cactux](#): > > However it would be wise to have a plan for when you come to that river to find a bridge to cross over. Iā€™m actually looking at Adguard dns servers as an alternative. ---
**Author:** ![cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/cactux/32/134907_2.png) [@cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/cactux)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:28pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/16 "2025-11-15T13:28:32Z")
> [@Cphusion](#): > > Adguard dns I was going to suggest that. šŸ˜€ ---
**Author:** ![MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/mynameisrichard/32/111876_2.png) [@MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/MyNameIsRichard)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:31pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/17 "2025-11-15T13:31:17Z")
Iā€™m now using the mullivad dns adblock servers ---
**Author:** ![MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/mynameisrichard/32/111876_2.png) [@MyNameIsRichard](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/MyNameIsRichard)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:31pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/18 "2025-11-15T13:31:58Z")
The UK is not really any better, but at least it goes through our parliament, I suppose. ---
**Author:** ![cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/user_avatar/forum.endeavouros.com/cactux/32/134907_2.png) [@cactux](https://forum.endeavouros.com/u/cactux)\ **Post date:** [November 15, 2025, 1:41pm UTC](https://forum.endeavouros.com/t/switzerland-plans-surveillance-worse-than-us/76393/19 "2025-11-15T13:41:00Z")
> [@albersc2](#): > > Iā€™m not sure whether Iā€™m more worried about the law itself or the way they intend to impose it, without even going through Parliament. Both are worrisome. > [@albersc2](#): > > Unfortunately, the world we live in is increasingly moving toward an authoritarian control model, which is essentially a disguised dictatorship. I guess thatā€™s what they call illeberal democracy or authoritarian democracy. Call me a pessimist but I wonā€™t be shocked that we will soon-ish see the people in the office change their current uniform of suit and tie with uniform ā€œuniformā€ and start with infamous saluting instead of handshake. I stop there because I donā€™t want this thread to get political, closed and myself being flagged or GOD forbid banned šŸ¤Ŗ